I'm really freaked out, and it has to do with Hogwarts Exposed

[zelda_queen]

Okay, where to begin with this thing?

First of all, you guys know that I use this journal almost exclusively for ranting in actual reviews. I don't have entries for personal issues or day-to-day matters or most anything that isn't an actual sporking or recap. But I have to talk about this. It's really, really, really got me freaked out.

It's about Hogwarts Exposed.

You all might remember some time ago my mentioning that I made a TV Tropes page dedicated to it. At the time, I figured it was pretty inconsequential. The sporkings were finishing up, it had been literally years since any updates of any kind, and it was my first stab at actually making a page for anything.

Some days ago, someone began seriously editing the page. Specifically, someone began vehemently defending it.

I shall repeat that. Someone, claiming to be a serious fan of Hogwarts Exposed, showed up and has been insisting that the page was clearly biased and needed "correcting".

I don't mean a few small changes either, nor do I mean that they are removing unnecessary natter on the IJBM page (which has happened before, yes, and I do understand why the mods want to down accusations of pedophilia, however justified it may be) or trying to make the page look more professional or moving YMMV tropes to the proper page. No, this person is insisting that Hogwarts Exposed is a piece of fine writing and is seriously defending this thing.

Thus far, here are a number of various claims this person has made, either to me directly in PM, on the entry pages itself, or the IJBM pages:

- Hogwarts Exposed d oes not count as child porn, because "There has to be minors involved for it to be child pornography. Fictional characters do not count as human beings, and therefor, do not count as minors, therefor it is not child pornography". Apparently this person thinks that child porn is porn staring real children and not the sexual exploitation of children, period.

- Hermione was in no way Chickified. He has, as of last editing, put her down as Action Mom ("Hermione, if you fuck with her kids. She will stay up for days to hunt you down"), Badass Bookworm, Badass in Distress, Battle Couple with Harry (refresh my memory, did she ever actually do any fighting with him in the series?), and Mama Bear

- It's unfair to trash the series for being lolicon, because people on TV Tropes defend Kodomo No Jikan. (For those who don't know, Kodomo No Jikan is a manga/anime about a nine-year-old girl who, after dealing with many emotional issues, declares that she's her twenty-three-year-old teacher's girlfriend and starts resorting to sexual harassment and blackmail at times to win his affections. Tellingly, its North American title was planned to be "Nymphet", but it was never actually released, due to the vast controversy over it)

- The various subplots, including Emily's bet with Rosaline, are totally not idiot plots. Even if they are, they ought to be stretched out because if the characters showed sense and solved the problems accordingly, there would be complaints about how conflicts were resolved too quickly

- It's fine that the Mary Sues don't overcome flaws like their idiocy, because some characters like Buffy the Vampire Slayer are meant to not overcome their flaws

- It's impossible to have a non-strawman evil lawyer. Specifically, "The problem with making non-strawman bad guys is the situation. Bullchip, for example, couldn't be physically threatening. All he had was lawyering. It's hard to do anything non-strawman with an evil lawyer. The only way to make them evil is to make them a threat to the characters, but they normally can't be physically imposing (unless they work for an evil law firm, but that idea has been done). So they have to pose a threat by trying to cause other problems for the characters, by attacking their morality. Since we're supposed to agree with the morality of the main characters in this, they come off as strawmen because the only way to make them a threat is for them to be strawmen. You could argue that they should win more often, but that might not be easy to do, especially if you're trying to avoid mentally torturing your characters (an easy thing to do, if you come to think of them as human beings you care about). Plus, if you've plotted out the storyline already, which it seems that Neil has done, then you're not going to want to divert from your plan"

- Harry totally wasn't engaging in child grooming-esque behavior with his little harem. The sexual topics he talked about with the girls were all totally age-appropriate, because "Pre-teens are having sex very often these days, and talk about sex a whole lot. I personally saw R-rated movies with sexual content before I was a teen, and in once case, before I was 10. Puberty is starting earlier than ever in both sexes (I had a friend with b-cups (at least) in third grade, and that was before people started noticing the earlier puberty in kids that's been going on)" (That one seriously squicked me out, because it sounds like the narrator from Lolita talking about his little nymphet stepdaughter)

- It's normal for parents to spoil their children and let them get away with behavior like Harry and Hermione do with their girls. That totally makes their parenting alright

- The series wasn't filled with spelling and grammar errors. Every time this was pointed out, he insisted that he simply didn't notice them or wasn't bothered by them

- He has made pages for Hogwarts Exposed for Crowning Moment of Awesome, Crowning Moment of Heartwarming, and Crowning Moment of Funny. In other words, he put Hogwarts Exposed on the Sugar Wiki

I'm...genuinely freaked out by this guy. I can not, for the life of me, understand why he's defending this thing so badly. I mean, I've stood up for bad stuff I've liked, lord knows, but to go on this much? To say "It's totally not misogynistic and pedo-wank" even after acknowledging Neil's insistence that he intends for everything to be seen as totally innocent.

And to top it all off, I honestly have a sneaking suspicion that he could be Neil. I'm serious.

So yeah. I'm really freaked out and confused by this guy, and I just need to get my head together. This guy astonishes and infuriates me, and I know it's a public wiki and I shouldn't be so bothered, but...Hogwarts Exposed! Who the Hell would go to such lengths to defend that thing???

Soooooo yeah. That's all from me. I've had my rant, I'm tired and I'm going to go to bed and hope things make more sense when I wake up.

And please, don't flame this guy. Just don't. Things are uneasy with the YMMV wars going on, but there hasn't been nuclear warfare yet. Best to keep it that way, no? ^^;;;;

So yeah. Bed. Now. G'night! :D

EDIT: JULY 12, 2011

Well, we can add a few more things to this batshittery.

This actually came before, but I forgot to mention it. This idiot pulled a straw argument (pretty good job of it, considering that he allegedly doesn't know what one is), after I reviewed the series and called it "sick". His reply, quoth I, was "I really don't think we should judge a work on whether or not it's "sick", as if we let things be censored for being "sick", people will start censoring things that they think are "sick", but others don't (like a right wing fundamentalist would censor homosexuality, a hick would censor mixed races, so on and so forth). There's even precedent for it happening. In the 70s, Sesame Street was banned in many southern areas for showing kids of different races playing together. You give people a bit of power and they'll abuse it". Really.

Apparently our friend has a bizarre hatred of lawyers. "As for the lawyer part, yes, that would be a realistic portrayal. However, realistic and entertaining are two very different things. A normal court case is boring most of the time. Need proof? Go watch the Casey Anthony trial. It's on every day, at least here. Worst case scenario, go watch it online. Court cases are boring. Court cases with politically motivated lawyers that would become fast friends with Wolfram & Hart, however, are fun to watch/read about. So having a Moral Guardian try to ruin the lives of the main characters only to be chewed up and spit out is much better. And yes, lawyers are just doing their job. Unfortunately for them, I fucking hate that excuse. Defending obviously evil monsters for money just makes me sick (seriously, what kind of human being can defend most of the people that need lawyers?). ". I'm really tempted to make some nasty statements about why a guy who loves Hogwarts Exposed and may actually be Neil would be so pissed at lawyers, but I won't. All I'll say is that yet again, there's a lovely straw arguement for you, along with him trying to take the higher moral ground. I ain't biting, shiny.

Folks, the group sporkings have been dragged into the arena. After this dude made a Crowning Moment of Awesome page for the series (naming, among other things, Caitlin's duping of Matt), the entire sporking was put up on the page. We ended up with this:

The Das Mervin sporkings of the series are excellent works of humor and riffing that tear this depraved series to the ground. But they topped themselves when several members wrote a series of Spitefics that accurately analyses and exploits the plotcanyons of the series.

• Your Mileage May Vary. I found the sporkings to be poorly written, with cheap parodies not worthy of Seltzer And Friedberg. As for the spitefics? It reminds me of Seltzer And Friedberg again. Cheap parodies and mockeries for easy laughs rather than anything intelligent or witty. And it's fanfic of fanfic of fanfic. This is just getting silly. Or lame. It depends on which one we're talking about. Ironically, the spitefics are often much more Sue-filled, and plot hole filled (complete with random fish thing lawyers from America, who are author inserts). However, the first one of the third page is funny (in the same way that The Best Page In The Universe is).
  
  
  • You're bitching about AUTHOR INSERTION in Spitefics written about a series that involves copious amounts of Author Inserts(but in the form of UNDERAGED CHILDREN) and Author Filibuster?
  
  
  • Yes, yes I am.
  
  
  • Then I'll bitch about you supporting a pedophile's wanking material...
  
  
  • Personally, I'd say it's a Crowning Moment of Awesome for anyone who managed to read through this junk, and if it weren't for the awesome sporking than I don't think anyone but the uh... fans would make it through this. Plus, you can just admit that you don't like Das Mervin and co. for pointing out the myriad flaws in the fic, not because it's unfunny. Oh yeah, and don't dis the Lurking Runcible. Each one of its appearances was a humongous CMOA, especially when he humiliated Harry for touching girls' privates and when he defended the Moral Guardians (as in, both). Plus, so what if he's from America? The author's from America, and Write What You Know. Not to mention, you know, that Hogwarts Exposed also has a ton of Plot Hole and Mary Sue problems too- far more than any spitefic, in this troper's opinion.
  
  
  • I don't see nearly as many flaws as you do, and I did not find the sporkings or spitefics to be funny. I have a different sense of humor than you. That is legal. As for Lurking, how does he have any power in a Wizarding Court? He's a baby Murloc (as the writer said himself). Babies from other universes should have no legal power here. In fact, would it even be possible for a non-human creature to become a lawyer? And why would he? I don't see the Plot Holes, and I barely see the Mary Sues.
  
  
  • At what point did Lurkythespork say his character was a baby Murloc? A murloc, sure, but not a baby. As for his power in the Court, did you not READ the part where he clearly stated that he was Timmy's attorney? You BARELY see the Mary Sues or the plot holes? So Lego Genetics works fine with you because A Wizard Did It? You know who also tried to pull A Wizard Did It? Jose Quesada when he tried to explain how Mephisto could somehow dynamically alter huge world-changing events. And you barely see the Mary Sues? So Jamie's speshulness to the point of semi-molestation by a unicorn doesn't stand out to you? Or Emily's ability to basically make HER point the only point that's true, even when there's gaping holes in her arguments and her inability to understand that some people might just be uncomfortable with a PRETEEN GIRL flashing neatly shaven crotch to the world? Or how about Caitlin, the little wannabe-Woobie that's down on herself all the time despite the fact that she's getting everything handed to her on a silver platter
  
  

strong>And yes, I took a screencap of it, so no one can say it didn't happen. so yeah, drink that one in. We get...*scans* this idiot outright saying that he doesn't see any plot holes or Mary Sues, thinks that the convoluted explanation of how the Ministry of magic tracks unbroken hymens or how Amanda figured out that Jamie was a nudist made perfect sense, and claims that the spite fics (which point out exactly how Hogwarts Exposed makes no sense in terms of legality, canon, or REALITY) are nonsensical, Sue-filled, and stupid. And I do so love how he takes the appearance of the Lurking Runcible, which is clearly both meant to be lighthearted and a way for Lurky to point out the contrivances, convoluted logic, and general selfishness and idiocy the main characters show.

Edit: June 23, 2011

The troll formerly known as HG131 has been banned from TV Tropes after the mods were informed of his trolling on das_sporking. When he bitched about it, the mod's reply stated that this was not the first time he'd been told off for defending pedophilia before. Yippee!

Comments

[gehayi.livejournal.com]

I bet the guy defending it is Neal.

[greenerygripes.livejournal.com]

Me too.

[szaleniec1000.livejournal.com]

That thought did cross my mind.

[zelda-queen.livejournal.com]

Thought so as well. On his Yahoo page, if you called Neil out on anything, he'd just be like "Well that's your opinion, but Emily having sex with Caitlin was perfectly innocent and if you think that one girl eating out on another is perverted, that says more about your mind than my fic". This guy hasn't exactly said that yet, but that feeling's there.

[szaleniec1000.livejournal.com]

I did also notice a certain spelling/usage mistake I'd come to associate with Neil, but that doesn't prove anything in itself.

[kawaiicow.livejournal.com]

Woah. Just...
...
That dude disgusts me.

[kawaiicow.livejournal.com]

I'm reading the page right now and it is really pissing me off. Not only are they defending the series (using sentences that are sometime incomprehensiale, even if read twice) they keep on pointing out the 'source canon' (if that means what I think it means) moments like they are waving a tiny, tiny flag with all the strength in his emiciated arms(I am sorry to be rude about their physical appearance, but this is really annoying me).
YES editor, fanfics are supposed to have elements of the source material, especially if it is set in the same universe. However, this doesn't make the fic good, it just means that it isn't an AU.

[greenerygripes.livejournal.com]

As a troper, I can just say that HOPEFULLY with the number of tropers on the site every day, this will all be quickly fixed.
Justice demands it.

[zelda-queen.livejournal.com]

It's going pretty slowly. He trolls the page constantly, either sniping back or deleting stuff he doesn't like. I'm giving it not much time before the mods say to hell with it and just lock the page.

[szaleniec1000.livejournal.com]

Still no response to my breakdown of just how Hermione is in fact chickified on the headscratchers page. Not that I've seen a convincing counterargument from them for anything I've said about HE in the entire time the edit war's been going on.

[zelda-queen.livejournal.com]

Yeah, dunno how he'd spin it besides his usual fare of "Well *I* just don't see it!!!"

Honestly, you'd think a guy who's such a fan of Joss Whedon's work would recognize something that so obviously was misogynistic, but no. -_- I suppose not.

Callin' down the lightning again!

[das-mervin.livejournal.com]

Good sir, I say unto you!



And that's it.

Seriously. That's it. I have zero tolerance for this stuff by this point when it comes to HE. So...that's it. That's ALL I have to say.

*tips hat* Good day.

[southerngaelic.livejournal.com]

........................

I think it's Neil. Most 'fans' of HE tend to stay within the Yahoo! group. At least, that's what I've seen so far.

My skin is crawling. Literally crawling from all of this.

[szaleniec1000.livejournal.com]

The latest is apparently that we shouldn't judge HE!Harry for perving on his 15-year-old adopted daughter because there's crap on TV in a completely different country. No, really:

# [HG131:] Actually, even then, I wouldn't see Unfortunate Implications. 15 is legal in the Wizarding World [sic], and 16 is legal in many first world countries (including many US states). So yeah, he's not doing anything illegal.
# [szaleniec1000:] As someone who lives in one of those countries, it might be legal for a 23-year-old to hook up with someone only just at the age of consent (though not if he's her teacher) but it's nowhere near being socially acceptable.
# [HG131:] Well, if you're going to have this debate with me, you should be warned that I never care what society thinks. This is the same society that got Jersey Shore multiple seasons, gave us American Idol and screwed Firefly. So as far as I'm concerned, their opinions don't matter, and should just be ignored. So therefore, I still say it's fine.

[zelda-queen.livejournal.com]

"Well, if you're going to have this debate with me, you should be warned that I never care what society thinks. This is the same society that got Jersey Shore multiple seasons, gave us American Idol and screwed Firefly. So as far as I'm concerned, their opinions don't matter, and should just be ignored. So therefore, I still say it's fine."

..It's Neil. It has to be. The way he words that, it's exactly like he's saying "I don't care what you say, I'll write it the way I like it". And you're right, he's judging it by American society and not British society.

Incidentally, he just said this on American society: "I wouldn't call it hate, just a wide dislike for most of the people, the politicians, the shows, the attitudes, the corporations, the "we'll kill you for money" nature of our health care system, the obsession with war and a few other things."

Got issues, Neil?

Incidentally, do you happen to have any idea how to make a Nightmare Fuel page for a specific work? Because I'd dearly love to do one to for this fic. -_-

[szaleniec1000.livejournal.com]

... I think I've actually got our "friend" to admit that Neil fucked up!

No, I personally think the author didn't even think of her proposing being a possibility, not because of a character thing, but because it never even entered his mind. We've all had those "Why didn't I think of that?" moments.

[zelda-queen.livejournal.com]

Ha ha, nice! XD I think that's about as close as we'd get.

Incidentally, in an effort to cool things down and get this nutter off of the warpath, I cut down the natter on the CMOA page and tightened things up on the main page. >_< With any luck, that'll mollify him and maybe get him to stop patrolling the page.

[szaleniec1000.livejournal.com]

Another update (sorry if it looks like I'm spamming XD ) I Googled the IP address Mervin mentioned here and... just guess who posts to TVTropes from the same address. Go on, guess.

[southerngaelic.livejournal.com]

I think the same person has been replying to all our comments we made on das_sporking. I got a snitty little comment this morning, saying that I was wrong to label HE as child porn because the law doesn't extend to fictional characters so it makes it okay.

Sounds like our edit-happy TV Troper, doesn't it?

[zelda-queen.livejournal.com]

Why am I not surprised? -_-

Question: Would it be possible to report him for this? I know he's doing stuff off-site, but given how the mods know about all that's going on on HE, couldn't they at least warn the guy or something?

And if not, should he be called out over there or not? :/ I know the fucker would deny being the troll, but if we prove he has the same IP address, there's not much he can do.

A footnote to the TVTropes saga

[szaleniec1000.livejournal.com]

Check out the edit banned thread.

HG131: Ok, I'm confused. I have no idea what I've done to get an edit ban (is editing suspension the same thing? The url is the same). I avoided getting into edit wars (very carefully), so I have no idea what I did. [You damnable liar.]

Fighteer: HG131, your ban is for exporting your deviant political views to other websites, particularly Livejournal. In doing so, you have made TV Tropes look bad. I warned you in the past about this, and in reviewing your recent edits on this site as well as your posts outside it, it's clear that you've simply decided to be sneaky about it rather than learn your lesson. That's your choice, of course, but you're going to have to find some place to express your views that is not TV Tropes. You are permanently banned and we will not be allowing you back. Goodbye. [And there was much rejoicing.]

HG131: What are you talking about? I've never even posted on Livejournal. [O RLY? Someone else just happened to be flaming HE reviews from your IP address?] Even if I had, we have to follow this website's rules on OTHER WEBSITES now? So let me get this striaght, we have to follow TvTropes rules on other websites, and if we have differing political views from you guys, you'll punish us anyways? Do I even need to point out how fucked up that is?

Ever the victim, isn't he? I think any reply I could make there would probably get me banned too. And I still think he's Neil himself.

Re: A footnote to the TVTropes saga

[zelda-queen.livejournal.com]

Oh that is BEAUTIFUL! XD I bet he's pissed. Did the fool really think we weren't going to figure it out and report him? He had all the subtlety of an exploding cigar at a state funeral, to quote Dave Barry.

[yemi-hikari.livejournal.com]

I know this is old but... good lord, there is so much LOGIC FAIL it isn't funny. I am glad to hear that this guy has been banned from TV Tropes.

[zelda-queen.livejournal.com]

That dude was BATSHIT. He would just camp out on that page and make horrible accusations and...gah!

XD The only thing I regret is not having a chance to call him out on being a troll before he was booted. I wasn't sure how long it would take for him to be banned, and didn't want to have to deal with him more than necessary. But if I could have, I would have said "Such a shame you abused the anonymous reviews like that, especially since you compared the abuse of comments sections to the invention of the atom bomb!" (And yes, he did just that -_-)

[greener221.livejournal.com]

There is no hope for Darwinism as long as this monster is still alive.

What confuses me more is how smalltime dipshits like Spidgewood and Nesshelper get ED pages, but this abomination ducks under 4chan's radar completely.